Hi,

I have used Canon 550D(better known as Rebel T2i) with Nikon vintage lenses. Now I am thinking to buy full frame camera and of course just released Canon 6D mark II sounds tempting. However of course just released camera has some "extra" price. Maybe it would be actually good time to buy some old model with the good price. So what do you guys think? Any suggestions?

Also I am concern that if my vintage lenses will work with full frame camera since the lens mounting seems to be different or does it need just a another kind of lens adapter?

Please share your thought.

-Juha

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Many of the features offered in the latest cameras are not much use for stop motion, such as burst speeds, 60fps HD video, extreme ISO settings, even a 26 megapixel sensor.

As stopmo is already effectively shooting on 5k when taking stills, we already have plenty to play with to cut it down to HD, or even 4k. 

It seems to me that the features we do need are reliability and longevity. So choosing to buy a low shutter count secondhand camera body of a model that is tried and tested would make sense, and you could get several for the price of a new bells-and-whistles camera.

Thanks for the answer Simon.

I agree with you. Though I guess features like better light sensitivity, better picture quality are probably better in a newer versions. However probably older 6D or 5D Mark ii or iii are probably already good enough in this point of view and much more better that my camera now. :)

I think I will probably try to find a good offer of a Canon 5D mark iii or older version of 6D.  


Simon Tytherleigh said:

Many of the features offered in the latest cameras are not much use for stop motion, such as burst speeds, 60fps HD video, extreme ISO settings, even a 26 megapixel sensor.

As stopmo is already effectively shooting on 5k when taking stills, we already have plenty to play with to cut it down to HD, or even 4k. 

It seems to me that the features we do need are reliability and longevity. So choosing to buy a low shutter count secondhand camera body of a model that is tried and tested would make sense, and you could get several for the price of a new bells-and-whistles camera.

Do bear in mind that the picture quality for stills is way higher than that required for movies, as the picture is only seen for 1/25th of a second in a movie but gazed at for as long as you like with a still. This is why even fairly basic DSLRs are pretty good for stopmo.

I bought a 7D body a while ago on eBay. It had a shutter count of 7000 and I got it for about £300. Yes, it is a crop-frame camera, but I have lenses that cover focal lengths from 10mm to 210mm, so it isn't a problem. Possibly my next camera will be a 5D, but only if it has a very low shutter count. Anything like 50,000 suggests professional use and a hard life. Although it is believed that the top cameras are good for about 200,000 actuations.

Yes, I know. But in our coming short film we did shoot our live action parts with 6K Red Dragon. My DSLR Canon 550D(better known as Rebel T2i) can do 4K but not 6K. Though it is a bit old camera now. And on the other hand I am not sure does it make difference to the final film, when the final product is anyway compressed to HD resolution. Well also I guess depends what kind of export framegrabber can do. I am using Dragonframe.


Simon Tytherleigh said:

Do bear in mind that the picture quality for stills is way higher than that required for movies, as the picture is only seen for 1/25th of a second in a movie but gazed at for as long as you like with a still. This is why even fairly basic DSLRs are pretty good for stopmo.

I bought a 7D body a while ago on eBay. It had a shutter count of 7000 and I got it for about £300. Yes, it is a crop-frame camera, but I have lenses that cover focal lengths from 10mm to 210mm, so it isn't a problem. Possibly my next camera will be a 5D, but only if it has a very low shutter count. Anything like 50,000 suggests professional use and a hard life. Although it is believed that the top cameras are good for about 200,000 actuations.

You can go for the huge image size if you have a video editor that can handle them.  Dragon frame does not need to be able to export the final images, in whatever size they are.  It saves them to a folder, so as long as you have software that can import that size, you can work with them.

I'm happy with a 7d, with the smaller sensor size, and images at 5184 x 3456.  I've used it to shoot animation for one live action film the was shot 4k, but my own stuff is normally finished at 1920 x 1080 HD.  Would your 6k film actually be finished at 6k and shown that way, or would it be scaled down to 4k for release?  

I don't know enough about the technicalities, but I have been told that 4k compressed to HD for release retains more detail than footage originated at HD resolution. This would make sense to me, as some clarity gets lost each time footage gets rendered, so starting out with high resolution makes sense.

The question then is: Does 6k footage compressed to HD look more hi-res than 4k given the same treatment? I suspect that it will look pretty similar, but that's just a guess. If, on the other hand, you will be exporting in 4k, then I would think you need to originate at the same resolution. Which takes you back to the big 26 megapixel sensors....

Thanks for your answer Nick, I love your tutorials in youtube. You haven't posting anything lately.

Yes of course one can create the video clip also in a video editor program, I just did not think about that. 

I was actually hoping that you Nick would answer, because I remember that you have a 7D and I was wondering if you still use that. Do you know if I can use the same vintage Nikon lenses if I buy 6D? 7D has the same EF-S mount that my camera now. Well I guess 7D could be one option also to buy.   

StopmoNick said:

You can go for the huge image size if you have a video editor that can handle them.  Dragon frame does not need to be able to export the final images, in whatever size they are.  It saves them to a folder, so as long as you have software that can import that size, you can work with them.

I'm happy with a 7d, with the smaller sensor size, and images at 5184 x 3456.  I've used it to shoot animation for one live action film the was shot 4k, but my own stuff is normally finished at 1920 x 1080 HD.  Would your 6k film actually be finished at 6k and shown that way, or would it be scaled down to 4k for release?  

The 6d Mk2 has the EF mount, which means that it can take the old manual lenses using an adapter ring.


Yes Simon, it does make sense that the higher resolution looks still bit more better after compression than lover res shooted fotage.  What is the final resolution in our short film? I am not sure if the movie theaters can play 6k or even 4k? I guess some of them can. Well I think final resolution will be not more than 4k.

It is just that the 6k fotage feels so much better quality than the animation fotage I am doing for the film.  Of course in the live action shooting we had 16 different ZEISS Cinematography lenses to choose. While my lens collection if pretty limited. Well we will see how they will blend together after compositing and grading. :) 


Simon Tytherleigh said:

I don't know enough about the technicalities, but I have been told that 4k compressed to HD for release retains more detail than footage originated at HD resolution. This would make sense to me, as some clarity gets lost each time footage gets rendered, so starting out with high resolution makes sense.

The question then is: Does 6k footage compressed to HD look more hi-res than 4k given the same treatment? I suspect that it will look pretty similar, but that's just a guess. If, on the other hand, you will be exporting in 4k, then I would think you need to originate at the same resolution. Which takes you back to the big 26 megapixel sensors....

The old manual Nikon, Olympus, and other brands of lens that were made to use on 35mm film cameras will cover the larger sensor, since that sensor is the same size as the 35mm still frame.  

I use higher resolution images for doing the chroma-keying and wire removal, to get the cleanest edges, then scale the images down to HD after compositing.  So I definitely agree that working in higher res can be good for that stage of the production.  

I honestly don't know if an image that didn't need any work done on it looks better in HD if it originated as a larger image, or not.  It would be interesting to test it, shooting one of those lens sharpness test charts, and see if the 6k or 4k shots looked better after reducing to HD.  Any stills will, of course, look better than HD video, which is compressed so it can play in real time.  I might look online to see if there is a lens chart I can download and print out.

I haven't been able to post any films or tutorials, we've been busy cleaning up the house, flat hunting, and moving, so we can get some repairs and renovations done.  My studio is half storage room, half studio for the next few months.  I do hope get some time to do small stuff in a month or so.

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